CNN: "She was on her way to church on Easter Sunday and when she saw the high flood waters at Mount Calvary Powerhouse Church in Poplar Bluff, Missouri, she almost turned around and went home. A church van was shuttling people through the water and Mrs. Dugas helped transport a few people in her car as well. She had no idea that one of the young men in her car was planning to be baptized that day. Marcus Pegues was baptized in the flood water. "He got baptized in the water that God provided for us..."
Meanwhile, tornadoes rip through 6 states killing 272 people. I guess 'God' was busy providing flood waters to baptize Marcus.
This is a classic example of people trying to anthropomorphize nature, and at the same time, grace god for anything that they can perceive as "good" and ignore the destruction that it causes or fails to prevent (or at least protect it's "children" from).
ReplyDeleteThis is the same sort of delusional nonsense as when people talk about the "grace of god" for saving a single child's life from a fire that wiped out 100 other children. Credit god for the good, but don't blame it for the bad. Also, never mind that it is discriminate. Never mind that it doesn't stop psychopaths from slaughtering innocent people (or that it creates psychopaths in the first place). Let's reinforce our delusional superstition by taking a horrific natural disaster like a flood and twist it into something "good" like condemning another child by baptizing him into servitude to a self-serving, vicious, megalomaniac.
I couldn't agree more. This is where religion crosses the line from being an individual's personal belief, to a delusional public opinion accepted by society as the norm. Meanwhile, atheists are outcasts and considered 'crazy.'
ReplyDeleteThe irony amuses me, but reaches a new level of sadness.
The truth of the matter is, however, that the person who claimed that God provided the flood water couldn't really PROVE that he actually DID that, just as another person couldn't PROVE that God brought about the tornadoes. This idea that God foreordains EVERYTHING that occurs palpably false from the Scriptures. People who say things like that make Christianity out to be something it is NOT. It COULD HAVE BEEN God, yes, but you can't prove that point.
ReplyDeleteSorry, "occurs IS palpably false"
ReplyDelete@Twelve - That's true. And there is just as much reason to believe he brought about the floods and tornadoes in the middle of the god-fearing, jesus-loving bible belt as there is to believe he brought about the Tsunami in Japan or anything "good" that happens in any xian's life, for that matter.
ReplyDeleteI think the point is, if there exists a "loving and caring god", why would he allow any of this to happen to his children? Why allow so many to suffer from nature's wrath when he could easily prevent it.
This is an easy argument against xianity. If they were actually following the OTG, as they say they are, shouldn't their lives be so much better than the rest of ours? Why does their loving god allow them to suffer along with the rest of us, when he obviously "talks through" their "good pastors" like Albert Odulele, Stephen Green, Vaughn Reeves, Eddie L. Long, George Alan Rekers, Todd Bentley, Joe Barron, Michael Reid, Thomas Wesley Weeks, III, and Coy Privette.
BTW, I mean "good" in a very christian way:
Albert Odulele - sexual assault (with boys)
Stephen Green - Family abuse
Vaughn Reeves - Swindling people out of over $13 million
Eddie L. Long - Used his position as the church leader to entice or coerce men into consensual sexual relationships in exchange for money, travel and goods.
George Alan Rekers - Hired gay male prostitute
Todd Bentley - Falsly claimed "faith" healing and cheated on his wife
Joe Barron - Solicited a 13-year old girl to have sex with him.
Michael Reid - Cheated on his wife for EIGHT years.
Thomas Wesley Weeks, III - Physical assault of his wife.
Coy Privette - Aiding and abetting prostitution.
Yep, looks like these guys are really "good" christians. Most of them probably highly supported anti-gay rights movements while at the same time, hiring, using, and abusing gay male prostitutes and/or children. Nice!
I'm an agnostic and I have MS. My religious friends and family do this kind of mental gymnastics trying to explain the value of prayer in curing my condition. As best as I can understand, God gave me MS so that I would learn to rely upon him to cure me of my MS. And while I listen to this I think - if this is true God must be a real a-hole.
ReplyDeletewww.elvisinmybasement.com
Kmuzu,
ReplyDeleteI couldn't agree more. Your condition, as with many other conditions human face, happens because humans are not perfect. We all develop problems, some worse than others. There is a biological reason for all of the medical issues we deal with. We're still evolving and evolution is not perfect, either.
The mentality of "let go and let god" is to give up on yourself. Never fall into that trap. There are a lot of things you can do with your condition, but you have to be in control of your own destiny, not put the responsibility on a fictional character.
The only belief you need is the belief in yourself to carry on and make each day better than the last.
@Dimondwoof:
ReplyDeleteRegardless of whatever happens in nature, no one can point to any one incident and say with certainty, "God did that." As to why He would let that happen is another issue. The Bible does teach that man is a free moral agent. It teaches that God is loving, and all-powerful, yes, but that God also allows us to live among each other and make decisions that influence one another. How could a person ever truly build qualities such as love, patience, temperance, etc. if they wewre not placed in situations of discomfort to a certain degree? And the Bible does not anywhere teach that Christians will always have "better" lives than worldly people. If it does, show the passage.
Concerning God "talking through" pastors, I do not agree with that teaching at all. It is not scriptural. It is a false teaching that denominations have made. So I agree with you that God does not literally "talk through" pastors.
And as far as citing pastors who have committed immoral actions, I agree with you completely that they are wrong in what they've done. However, that says nothing about the inspiration of the Bible or the existence of God at all. If it does, how?
@David Smalley:
ReplyDeleteCould you please provide one good argument for evolution, and not simply "change?" Thanks!
@Twelve,
ReplyDeleteYou must first realize asking for 'evidence of evolution' is like asking for evidence that the sun exists. Evolution is not a belief, it is scientific fact.
It is referred to as a 'theory,' because in the scientific world, a theory is used to explain a hypothesis. Once something is classified as a theory, it has been accepted by the scientific community as the most viable explanation of facts.
Anyway, I'm glad you asked, so here we go:
1) The Fossil Record - There are always gaps, but the pattern is clear enough to show that life has been around for millions of years, and has adapted over time. The fossil record gives us transitional animals such as whales with legs, and ancestors that have both human and ape traits. At the very least, with the Bible saying everything was made in 6,000 years, we can immediately discredit that as a reliable source.
2) Distribution of Species - Through the dating of volcanic ash, sediment, and layers of rock, we can get a good view of how the earth was formed, and when changes happened. In these layers, we find animals that are not found in other layers, giving us a good idea of when they lived. We also find animals in other layers that are very similar to the older ones, with slight adaptations to match the different time period and location. This tells us with enough time and environmental shift, animals either adapt to their surroundings through evolution, or they die—which is why it's called 'Natural Selection.'
3) Homologies - The similarities in bone structure from animal to animal is shocking. Humans and chimpanzees share 98.9% of the same DNA. Baboon hearts have been placed in humans to save their lives. We're so closely related, some of our body parts are interchangeable! Let me be clear: evolution does not state that people came from monkeys, but rather, that humans and monkeys share a distant common ancestor that is no longer living.
4) Artificial Replication - Scientists have proven over just a 2-3 year span, that we can induce evolution in guppies by altering their environment and predators. Several studies have been done like this, one only needs to research to find them.
5) Australopithecus - Paleontologists and Anthropologists have determined that this human/ape ancestor lived about 4 million years ago, and is closely related to homo habilus, and ultimately, homo sapiens (that's you). Just research these few terms and you will see why 97% of scientists do not believe in the creation account in the Bible.